My friend is looking for a resource to become fluent in French, he is forced to work with it. Asked to find a certain book, but it is not yet pirated on the resources of the wiki. My guess is that pirates have better alternatives for such a thing, so I’m launching a discussion.

I only ever heard about the book “Minna no Nihongo” in the context of learning Japanese.

  • cacti@ani.social
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    3 hours ago

    Immersion. Books or apps won’t teach them anything.

    Here are some resources:
    Input hypothesis
    Tatsumoto’s Guide to Learning Japanese (or any other language for that matter, just skip the kanji specific parts, and I wouldn’t recommend joining their community)
    Antimoon’s Learner Reports

    I had already written at length about the topic, but the OP I had replied to seems to have deleted their post so I’m just going to do it again.

    My native language is Turkish. I reached basic English fluency when I was ~14 years old and I’m currently doing Japanese immersion with my comprehension rate of the Japanese content I consume being around 90% (mostly video game content and anime). I achieved this primarily by consuming interesting content in my target language. I didn’t go to any language classes at all in both cases, and school itself likely only made my English skills worse.

    This technique essentially aims to replicate how people acquire their first language when they’re babies, which essentially means lots of comprehensible input and no output initially. Input comes first, output comes a few thousands of hours later, similar to how it takes 4 years for a human baby to have acquired the language just enough to be able to start speaking. How language acquisition itself works can be explained like this.

    Though in the case of adults this can take much less time with the help of flashcards, dictionaries, and reading (you should not start reading from the get-go though). And getting that much input is thankfully much easier in our age because of the Internet, and essentially all you need to do is watch interesting, comprehensible (visual cues help a lot) content in your target language. You should aim for 10,000 hours of comprehensible input for basic fluency, which would take around 4 years at 7 hours per day, or more unrealistically 1.5 years at 18 hours per day.

    I haven’t yet come across any guide other than Tatsumoto’s that promotes using only libre tooling for language acquisition, so that’s why I primarily recommend his website.

  • Rozz@lemmy.sdf.org
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    12 hours ago

    Not a book, but check if your library has access to any learning apps for free… or books for that matter.

  • idegenszavak@sh.itjust.works
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    13 hours ago

    If you visit enough russian warez sites you will learn what Скачать means. Usually that’s the second language of the pirate world after broken english.

    For books my first stop is Anna’s archive

  • TwilightKiddy@programming.dev
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    14 hours ago

    Not really about piracy, but doing language exchanges is a great way to learn a language. You teach someone your language, they teach you theirs. It’s free and it gives you more knowledge than any book. Natural languages don’t work with strict rules usually, natives speak by feel, the only way to learn that feel is by interacting with people.

    • Eq0@literature.cafe
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      11 hours ago

      There are some limitations though: often native speakers don’t have a deep understanding of the grammar rules they use, because they use them intuitively. So sometimes learning this way makes it a bit foggy. I often use this technique when I’m already familiar with the target language, At a basic level.

      • TwilightKiddy@programming.dev
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        8 hours ago

        That’s exactly why you want to do this. When people speak casually or are making jokes, nobody speaks with grammar in mind. Gathering this intuition for the language is exactly what I’m looking for when learning.

        • Eq0@literature.cafe
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          7 hours ago

          I’m okay breaking the rules if that’s how the language is usually spoken, but It’s still interested in learning the rule

    • IllNess@infosec.pub
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      11 hours ago

      How do I get started with language exchange?

      Any popular forums or an apps you recommend?

  • july@leminal.space
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    14 hours ago

    Look into Dreaming French (originally Dreaming Spanish but they recently extended to French).

  • razorcandy@discuss.tchncs.de
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    14 hours ago

    What is the book called? I can try searching for it.

    As for learning languages, I find that a combination of structured lessons (from an instructor or recommended course book) with speaking practice (with someone you know or through a language exchange program) works best. Other things that help are watching films or series in your target language, listening to music and translating the text.

  • teft@piefed.social
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    13 hours ago

    I just hung out with spanish speaking people and used duolingo (back when it was good) until I could speak and understand spanish. That way takes years though. I would recommend including structured classes for anyone who isn’t an auditory learner.

      • teft@piefed.social
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        10 hours ago

        They’ve changed it a bunch and they rely on AI more now. When I took it it was more like sentences and conversations repeated over and over. It may still be ok but I don’t think it’s as good as it was.

  • jwiggler@sh.itjust.works
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    14 hours ago

    There are a lot of language learning resources on the site i use. I did a whole Michel Thomas advanced audio course for portuguese that helped me learn the basics. What’s the title of the french book your friend is looking for?

    • zaknenou@lemmy.dbzer0.comOP
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      12 hours ago

      he first asked about: Mon alter ego 3
      then about fr to fr version of: Assimil - Le Nouveau Français sans Peine

  • land@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    14 hours ago

    Just use the AirLearn app. I’m learning Spanish on it. Pretty good. If you use an Android, there’s also a premium APK mod for it.

      • land@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        12 hours ago

        “We do have a dedicated creative team & language professionals who prepare the lessons” according to AppStore review.

        I use AirLearn over Duolingo which is trash when it comes to learning a language.

          • Eq0@literature.cafe
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            11 hours ago

            I think the whole premise of Duolingo that learning a language means translating to and from it is bonkers. I know multiple languages at various levels, and every time to speak I create my sentences in the target language directly. Translating is a totally different skill set