Full thread (archived): https://archive.ph/TA3k4
ROFL this thread is hillarious. OP sure picked the wrong instance to ask their question.
(For fuck sakes: Please do not ask questions (expecially questions that may involve politics) in TankieLiteEdition.ml, aka: lemmy.ml)
Cowbee giving a lesson on why anarchism should be the goal, and then whiplashing that into support of authoritarianism. Great job. Very praxis.
yes, china is proletariat, very smart
Clearly the hammer and sickle are above the luxury brand, therefore this symbolizes how the proletariat is in control of the means of production or something.
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Gucci is capitalist dipshit. If China wasn’t capitalist, they wouldn’t be selling there.
don’t touch the antiyanks! hes cwazy
The ruling class of China is the proletariat?
Surely they have never been to China.
I mean… I surely don’t mean to imply that most countries are much better in this regard, the US least of all, but come on.
Xi wants to extend his life through organ transplants. You know, just normal working class stuff!
No one ever seems to get what the “proletariat” is, either.
Visit enough countries around the world and you’ll eventually get to see how same-y the average person is, regardless of location. Working class people just live for getting through the next day and the small happinesses that life brings.
But political ideology is in the habit of molding the proletariat into whatever model citizen concept is pushed by the owner class. They construct a more convenient idea of the Everyman that fits their brand of politic and punish those who fail to adhere to that model.
This makes it more convenient for world governments to push nationalism like “Americans do X, Chinese do Y, and that’s why we hate each other,” based on the platonic concepts they envision their respective proletariat to be. The reality is that everyone is way more alike than they are different, and the ideologues in power hate that fact.
taiwan not seeking independence
Because they literally can’t. Like, imma point a gun at your forehead and tell you to not yell or i’ll shoot, would you yell?
Cowbee is an idiot that only took guided tour as a white person and then say nothing is wrong.
I have not spoken to every 中国人
But I am quite sure that cowbee has not spoken to any of them.
People like cowbee are even worse than dirty mainlanders.
🧐
Please don’t say “dirty mainlanders”, not cool, pal, I’m from mainland China and I do not support CCP
Legitimately, though I’d love it if a tankie was brave enough to come into this thread to explain why Western nations have better working conditions and more worker rights than those of China.
Fr fr. My parents literally have a 1.5x bonus for working overtime, more breaks (still not a lot, but proportionally its more than the jobs they had before in China), actual work safety (well idk what this administration is gonna do, but there are still some state laws in place), and its overall less work hours they had to work compare to China, also Unions. And my father had trouble finding a job in China. Also, there’s no protection against discrimination for older people, so if you look “old” they could straight up use that as an excuse to not hire you, and you have zero recourse. And sometimes in temporary layoffs, my parents can apply for unemployment compensation in the US, unemployments benefits are unheard of in China.
There are of course places better than the US (probably those in the EU), but PRC is not one of them.
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Go pull a 996 50c’er.
Yes, they do.
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China is committing genocide against the Uyghurs.
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cultural genocide against the Uyghurs
That’s not a real thing.
dilutes Tibetan culture and wants to
Show me the Tibetans who miss living as illiterate serfs under autocratic feudalism and I’ll show you the CIA-backed, “suck my tongue” royal family and its deputies.
The genocide denial is coming from inside the house.
focus on listening more than anything else
… because what you say might get you disappeared.
In order to eliminate class, we must support the advancement of a class.
Neat!
Ah yes
All states are authoritarian
That’s the only thing that is in fact true in that CCP propaganda vomit.
If every state is authoritarian, then none are.
Authoritarian has a definition that would be useless if everything falls under it.
Using it to claim that all states are and must be equally authoritarian, as a way to deflect criticism of authoritarians in a specific country, somewhat destroys the truth value of it. It’s like claiming that all substances are toxic; technically true, too much of literally any substance will kill you, but if I then tell someone that because water and cyanide both have a lethal dose, it doesn’t matter which they take because both are potentially deadly, I’d be attempting to deceive and therefore lying even if I use only technically true statements to imply a false conclusion.
“China is a democratic country”
I have seen things like this lately, like “communism is democratic”, I wonder if there is some specific agenda behind it.
just your usual tankies wanting so bad to be liberals but can’t admit it due to cognitive dissonance.
Communism is a term that means nothing nowadays because there’s 3+ completely different interpretations that do not agree with each other at all. That just kinda defeats the purpose of communication
Yeah I have seen lots of what seems like USA people thinking anything is communism…
well in theory Russian communism based its power on local soviets aka counsils
in practice, that function did not last ta few years.
True, but still not democracy. Hah especially not in practice ofc.
i’m sorry but i’m downvoting for absolutely cursed mandarin even though i disagree with this cowbee claim.
- YOU DON’T USE SPACES 😭 (unless you do fullwidth spaces between every character, which is the chinese version of mIxEd CaSe). to signal a pause just use the chinese comma instead. though for orthographical reasons many people often put spaces between latin-ish things (alphabet, digits) and characters which is completely fine and in fact i prefer it
- 小同志 is not— it just IS NOT! it’s also singular instead of matching the much butter english’s pluraling, which would add a -们 to the end and create the sense of patronizing community. not sure what you would replace it but maybe 同学们 ((my dear) students) or 少先队员们 (Young Pioneers, the CPC youth league’s youth league. membership for elementary students is all but socially mandatory) might do.
- i don’t think you say ”讲课“ here? it’s definitely a verb that exists but it just feels wrong here. maybe ”上课“
- idk why but i feel like this scenario should use the past perfect -了 (has-- -ed) 'stead of the present continuous 在- (is- -ing) in chinese. if you use the past perfect you can change the final characters to 开堂了
- 乖乖听话 is not “listen here”, it’s… literally “be obedient” but in a sense that it’s a juvenilizing phrase often used it on pets and kindergarteners. like the command you say before they do it and you say “good boy”. outside of that it has slight dom/sub sexual connotations. the closest thing to a mocking “listen here” is the quite long “大家伙儿走过路过不要错过，快来看一看，瞧一瞧——”. i’d just omit it while adding the pluralization
老师对不起，我只上了二年级，然后就出国了。。。 🤷♂️
I’m basically just using english grammar in place of the missing knowledge lol
Also, I kinda suck at doing translations, as you can tell lol, cant quite find the right phrases to match (I know I could’ve use google translate, but nah, too lazy)
So you admit you’re literate and thus not an emancipated peasant farmer? Opinions invalid, argument nullified, experience discredited. Checkmate shitlib capitalist.
Emm, i’m not seeing any issue here tbh. It’s basically mean “please be obedient little comrade, mr.cowbee is giving a lecture here”.
But yeah the english translation is kinda not match the tone of the mandarin.
i mentioned what problems i have with the mandarin on its own
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I mean on the second paragraph, they’re not entirely wrong. Chinese citizens do generally seem satisfied with the country and the quality of life there could be far worse. China isn’t democratic on a national level, it does have local elections with approved candidates.
It just depends how much you care about your freedom of speech, which is a common western value.
Personally, I think the status quo on China isn’t too bad.
Because if a Chinese citizen complains, they disappear.
Not necessarily. If you post about it online, you might get the post removed, banned, and at worst, a visit from the police. You can personally complain to officials though in private with no recourse. They just don’t want you stirring up a protest
Personally, I think the status quo on China isn’t too bad.
except for those under the threat of imperialism
Who?
Those victims of the Belt and Road Initiative, Mongolia, Tibet, Hong Kong, Uyghurs, and probably Taiwan later
and that’s just modern imperialism
Victims of the belt and road initiative? Mongolia also was granted independence ages ago.
The other ones you listed are regions that are part of China.
Suppression of some local cultures, sure, but that’s not really “imperialism”
it’s nice that you’re so selective about the suppression of local culture and foreign governments.
I assume that means you also don’t think the US is imperialist?
US can be more imperialist than China as it has a lot of military bases across the world and actively tries to influence the culture of foreign nations. China is largely self interested.
Although I don’t know to what extent is imperialism bad. I would prefer full on European imperialism than half-hearted selfish imperialism. Like building infrastructure in and supporting your colonies that cannot support themselves.
If PRC was given a military as powerful as the US, they’d be doing the same thing. Its not “X country is evil”, its ANY country being given that power WILL become evil.
The only way to avoid it is to NOT have ANY county becoming superpowers.
Is building infrastructure and supporting your colonies not imperialism?
Its much harder to find income in China, which is why my parents decide to immigrate to the US. (And before anyone says “socialized healthcare” nope, AFIAK, you don’t get free healthcare, at least not when my parents and I left)
Yeah, definitely not free. When I was working there I had to have an employer-provided health insurance plan to be eligible for routine care. No different from the US.
There is a state Medicaid/Medicare type of social insurance plan in China, but it really sucks and barely covers anything. Almost like Medicaid/Medicare.
The other crappy part about trying to get healthcare in China is that you never know when someone is about to try to sell you some TCM woo when you’re just looking for antibiotics.
TCM
Oddly enough, 凉茶 sort of works?
Maybe a placebo idk 🤷♂️
But yea my grandmother want to boil some weird herbs/animal organ… like… no thanks.
I have no idea if those stuff they sell at the TCM shops with those weird herbs actually do anything, but it taste bad and I have yet to hear from scientists talking about it, so nah, its just very bitter (or otherwise weird tasting) “soup” for unknown effects.
(I say “herb” but actually I have no idea what those plants things are, just search “traditional chinese medicine shop” and you’ll see what I mean. There are like tons of those in New York City lol.)
These TCM stuff is kinda fucking with my depression, because my parents are very skeptical of “western” medicine, especially antidepressants which affects the brain, so they do not want me to take medication for depression. And I’m still a dependent on their insurance, and I have to rely on them to pay for medical bills. They think its some evil spirit or something… 🤦♂️
So yea idk what to do, depression sucks, especially with the ongoing US wave of xenophobic policies by the current administration.
I love a good tea when I have a sore throat, because it helps alleviate the scratchy/coughy sensations.
But I’d also like some goddamn amoxicillin when I have strep, please.
I have a Chinese friend currently living there and is unemployed. They have said there are no benefits.
They still don’t have free healthcare. Although from what I hear, it’s substantially better. Someone I know spent a week in hospital in China, and was charged £500. Insurance paid for it all. Granted, they are paid less on average, but U.S. healthcare costs are ludicrous. I do believe China is struggling with an employment problem, though.
Is it also something like “you get free healthcare if you bribe the doctors?”
Idk what exactly do you mean by “bribe the doctors”.
Everything is out of pocket, you have to pre-pay for everything.
Its a common TV trope in Chinese drama shows that someone can’t pay for for an expensive emergency procedure, and then they somehow find a long lost relative (or a friend or something like that) and ask them to pay for it. Like… lmao, its got the Squid Game feel to it
Ah, okay, because that’s what I hear happened in my country. Literally, you had to bribe your way in to expect decent health care conditions and fair treatment - either with money or with products that were hard to find on the market. Bribes continued after 1989 as well, but not so much, and the newer generations reject being bribed altogether.
