Aside from any question of the practice or the conviction, that sentence is fucking excessive.
Call me crazy but “insulting / critiquing / feelings or sentiment injury” shouldn’t be a crime anywhere, that’s ridiculous.
That being said, if the law is “you gotta stay inside on this day” and you go outside… well, that’s illegal bro, and you took pictures documenting it.
Fair enough, he was even warned. Seems a bit silly turning up as a tourist and expecting to be exempted from another nation’s laws. Sure, anyone can have a view and an opinion about another nation’s laws, but you are not exempt.
There wouldn’t even be a problem if he didn’t immediately post it to Instagram. Fully deserved honestly.
I think it is expected from tourists to behave the way locals expect them to do. It seems this day required by law and even if it is a crappy law by outsider standards - it is still a local law…
You don’t sneak out in North Korea and tell everyone about you ditching your escorts - you don’t even think of smuggling drugs into certain countries. You don’t start making loud fun about Muhammad in Islamic countries… And so on.Then the tourist should just be deported, not imprisoned for a year.
Being a tourist is not an exemption from local laws. That’s why tourists got executed in some extreme cases before.
Do I think 1 year is too long? Yes. Do I think they deserve a punishment for being a criminal in the local sense? Also yes.Why punishment? Is the goal of prison not to reduce recidivism.
Sounds like simply deporting the lawbreaker and barring from re-entry would be more beneficial as they would not repeat offend and it would save on costs associated with locking up a person committing a victimless crime.
No that would mean no consequences for the criminal. If they just get away with a hand slap and a fee it means laws don’t have a power over them and foreign money solves all problems.
Perfect way to turn yourself into a territory for plunder.
This act sends a message: do not disrespect our laws, don’t come here and think you’ll not be punished for your actions.Deportation is a consequence. It ruins his holiday, and then every time he applies for a visa and they ask “have you ever been deported” he must answer yes (or lie on his visa application, which is even more illegal).
Oh, he will be deported, don’t worry. After he leaves jail.
What good does consequences do in this situation other than satiate a desire to make people suffer?
Does the horrors of the US prison system stop crimes? Retribution based systems are not the solution to breaking laws.
What it will do is force Balinesians to spend their taxes providing for this man instead of being able to be spent improving their lives.
C’est pour encourager les autres
Also it would be seriously unfair to treat a foreigner any better (or worse) than a local that committed the same crime.
I mean, I think the punishment is too strict for citizens too, although I don’t know how Bali conducts its prison system. I think mandatory community service on the weekends would be better than locking someone in a cell.
Foreigners should be immediately deported, like immediately shuttled to an outgoing plane. And they can sort buying back the items they lost later.
This is one of few instances I am in agreement with Melobol:
If insulting a custom is as cheap as a vacation expense, why bother learning to respect the custom of a national observance?
Luzian Andrin Zgraggen didn’t have to vacation in Indonesia. Heck, he could have flown himself off if he felt the custom was offensive. But he had to insult them, locals, and the people he was paying them to serve his wishes, all because he has the money to do so.
All of us comprehend incarceration doesn’t cease recidivism from rich swiss bourgeoisie, esp. a year’s worth. But what other way, than murder, do you see Indonesians can show they cannot be bribed for their respect?
Swiss bourgeoisie are worse than Han bourgeoisie, because they can whim NATO into trade and embargoes so Indonesia is left Cuban-ized.What they are getting for probably very little cost (I imagine prisoners don’t get much more than a cell and a cup of rice a day) - they now established couple of things, and probably the most important one:
Nobody will think of their laws as easy to pay yourself out of it.
There will be a tourist advisory for anybody to respect local laws.
The tourists will actually shut up on the day of silence.
And if these make less likely for rowdy and disrespectful people to visit… in my book that’s all win to them.
The guy - who is a total freaking idiot - didn’t deserve to loose one year of his life, but sometimes you are going to be made to be the example.Nobody is going to think of this article, it’s not going to be something on anyone’s mind the next time they don’t follow this law. Also it’s Bali, the cops shake people down for money all the time.
There already is, it’s not like they advise people to break local laws.
The ones who were going to will continue to do so as they always have, the ones who won’t won’t because they won’t think of the consequences. Considerate people aren’t so only because it’s the law.
It’s Bali, it’s economy is the rowdy party island and a handful of extremely rich Americans doing spiritual yoga in a mountain retreat.
All this is doing is imprisoning a person, with no long term benefit. But I guess some religious extremists will be happy they’re making someone suffer for disrespecting their religion.
Prison needs to be abolished not celebrated. ACAB and all that.
You mean like the Tate brothers?
Colonists aren’t “tourists.”
He very much intended to bribe his way out of insults.
What an extremist thing to do. Forcing everyone to follow your shitty religion isn’t cool. If you want to be silent yourself go for it.
If you don’t want to participate you don’t have to, just be respectful. No different from going to a country that observes, say, Christmas or Hanukkah and being a dick by trying to do things that are closed. (I can’t think of any days where stuff is closed for a cultural observance that isn’t religious in origin, but I’m sure some exist. Maybe national/independence days?)
They are literally banned from leaving their house and cannot use the Internet. There’s being respectful and there’s being repressed.
And in my country even with a majority Christian population celebrating Christian holidays you can still go to many shops and do things on those days because we recognise not everyone follows some bullshit religion and shouldn’t be forced to adhere to it.
So what? Your country isn’t Bali, Indonesia. The fact of the matter is that this is the law of that land, and nobody is exempt just for having strong opinions against it.
Like what’s your point here? You should be able to go to another country, tell them that you don’t like their laws, and enjoy some kind of immunity as a result? That they’ll just suddenly go “Hey, this foreigner is right, we should totally change our culture and laws to match their opinion!” If you can’t abide by such laws in such a country then don’t go to that country. It’s that simple. What you don’t do is go anyway and then openly insult and defy them, and then get upset when the place with extreme laws doles out harsh retribution.
Like them or not, extremist or not, these are their laws and this guy openly flaunted violating them:
Zgraggen boasted in Instagram posts that he had defied restrictions that prohibit residents and visitors from leaving their homes or accommodations except for emergencies.
In video clips shared online, Zgraggen smiled at the camera and described walking to a beach during the observance. In one, he called the tradition “crazy” and used an expletive.
Definitely not respectful of their laws. Tourists are probably given quite a large leash too, this guy was being downright insulting and hostile to them. He fucked around, and now found out.
Fuck laws, especially unjust ones based on religious oppression.
You’re on an anarchist instance coming in defending cops and state overreach. What a joke.
There is a difference between being an anarchist and being an egotistical foreigner who goes into a foreign land, tells the locals they’re all stupid and backward, and that his own culture is better and they should follow it instead.
You’re arguing in favour of the settler-colonist perspective of “These brown savages should adopt my Christianity!”
You’re only saying “fuck laws” now because you backed yourself into a corner. You didn’t have that opinion before. That’s also why you have this lie about me defending cops and laws instead of what I actually said, which was about the people of an island having their culture flagrantly disrespected by an outsider who thinks he’s better than them.
Anarchism is not about no laws or society at all. That’s a very FOX News view of it. It’s also very much not about imposing your own values and judgement upon other cultures and people who you choose not to respect.
why is it always WHITE westerners doing this, stop trying insult other countries in asia. the stupidest ones trying to go off in the jungles thinking they are safe(like the famous incident in central america), or to the adaman islands.
It isn’t, they are just the ones people care enough about that you hear about it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blasphemy_law_in_Indonesia#Selected_cases
A day of silence where the people stay inside sounds great. Turning off the Internet seems a bit much.
You’re describing the Covid lockdown that went over so well.
