I’m just going to point out that besides containers, systemd can now manage virtual machines:
systemd version we added systemd-vmspawn. It’s a small wrapper around qemu, which has the point of making it as nice and simple to use qemu as it is to use nspawn.
The idea is that we provide a roughly command line equivalent interface to VMs as for containers, so that it really is as easy to invoke a VM as it already is to invoke a container, supporting both boot from DDIs and boot from directories.
@TCB13@petsoi It seems to me that systemd is going the exact opposite of the original Unix philosophy of make a tool for a specific task, make it do it’s task well, and then use the necessary tools for the job, systemd is becoming one big piece of bloatware that gets in the way of use rather than helps it.
I don’t disagree with you but… it also provides a cohesive ecosystem of tools to manage linux. What we had before was a poorly integrated mess of smaller tools that was just too hard to maintain and sometimes use.
Besides not all systemd components come out of the box with the base binary, some have to be installed if you need them. And no, it doesn’t get in the way. :)
@TCB13 Problem is by being one big bloatware, rather than a set of small discrete tools, if one part of it misbehaves, your entire system is toast instead of just removing, replacing, or fixing that one part. That’s why that philosophy belongs in Windows NOT Linux.
Yeah, meanwhile I’ll keep using LXD / Incus for both containers and VMs.
Incus has a few advantages: an image repository, a nicer container manager (cli tools) and sane security defaults. By default Incus assumes your containers should be isolated and secure environments while systemd-nspawn is more about quick and dirty containers useful to compile something or run some trusted task.
The thing with Incus is that you get the image repository and manager and the permissions applied to containers make them isolated and secure environments by default running on another user etc etc
I’m just going to point out that besides containers, systemd can now manage virtual machines:
@TCB13 @petsoi It seems to me that systemd is going the exact opposite of the original Unix philosophy of make a tool for a specific task, make it do it’s task well, and then use the necessary tools for the job, systemd is becoming one big piece of bloatware that gets in the way of use rather than helps it.
I don’t disagree with you but… it also provides a cohesive ecosystem of tools to manage linux. What we had before was a poorly integrated mess of smaller tools that was just too hard to maintain and sometimes use.
Besides not all systemd components come out of the box with the base binary, some have to be installed if you need them. And no, it doesn’t get in the way. :)
@TCB13 Problem is by being one big bloatware, rather than a set of small discrete tools, if one part of it misbehaves, your entire system is toast instead of just removing, replacing, or fixing that one part. That’s why that philosophy belongs in Windows NOT Linux.
That actually could be really handy. I’ll have to check it out once this release moves downstream.
Yeah, meanwhile I’ll keep using LXD / Incus for both containers and VMs.
Incus has a few advantages: an image repository, a nicer container manager (cli tools) and sane security defaults. By default Incus assumes your containers should be isolated and secure environments while
systemd-nspawnis more about quick and dirty containers useful to compile something or run some trusted task.This is really hard to read.
Yeah, I was typing from my phone while being distracted by other people. Fixed now.
Thanks, that’s much easier to read. :)
Systemd can manage containers!? TIL
Yes…
And now also virtual machines.
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Yes 😂 😂 😂