trust me bro - Lemmy
lemmy.ml

Original Post (by mod !Luminous5481@anarchist.nexus): https://lemmy.ml/post/51590161

My comment that got me banned:

Remind me which nations have their capitalists leashed and which nations are leashed by their capitalists again?

Mod’s response:

China Tobacco is so powerful it prevented the CCP from instituting smoking bans for years, all because it pays for the entire Chinese military budget. get the fuck out of here with that capitalist propaganda bullshit, campist.

My response I would have posted:

What in your view is the correct alternative to “campism”?

Also, your counterexample is literally a state-owned enterprise? Doesn’t sound like unleashed Capital to me.

I don’t think there is any rule in the sidebar that could be stretched to justify the ban.

My final thought is:

We share the same anti-imperial goals. I think your side should consider whether you have been duped by the very state powers you live under into hating the nations that should be your greatest allies in the fight.

P.S.S.

I don’t have to agree with everything China does, and I don’t. I don’t think they have a good tobacco policy. I think they cater too much to cultural reactionaries. I think they allowed 996/hustle culture to get out of control and aren’t reining it in seemingly at all.

But if we’re going to honestly talk about China we have to also address the industrial/economic “miracle”, the elimination of homelessness and extreme poverty, world-leading education, and “whole process people’s democracy” (and the extremely high legitimacy it has among the actual Chinese citizenry)

  • Souvenir@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    5·
    2 days ago

    YDM

    Rule 1: memes only please, serious discussion is for other comms

    You proceeded to try and have a serious discussion in response to a meme.

    I see you were banned for capitalist apologia. I strongly suspect the mod was making fun of you, because you think of yourself as a leftist, when they banned you for that.

    My response I would have posted: … But if we’re going to honestly talk about China we have to also address the industrial/economic “miracle”

    No.

    This is a sub for discussing if a ban was justified, not the Chinese economy. The relevant rule you’re ignoring here:

    Keep the comments in YPTB posts about the moderation action itself, not about the general topic in which the moderation took place.

    Once again you’re ignoring community rules, to drone on about the Chinese economy and how great China is.

    It’s tedious. I think you should be banned here too. I wouldn’t invite you to my birthday party, even if someone was paying me.

  • Mystic Mushroom [Ze/Zir]@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    7·
    3 days ago

    You violated the communities rules apologizing for capitalists and an authoritarian state. Why would you think that this rhetoric would be welcome there? Because you identify as a leftist? I got news for you, anarchists have freedom of association and we don’t need to put up with tankie bullshit. YDM.

  • southsamurai@sh.itjust.works
    6·
    3 days ago

    Well, I gotta err on YDI with this one.

    You went hard in a meme community that specifically has rules against what you did. Like, it doesn’t matter if you’re right or wrong, it doesn’t even matter that the mod was a prick about it (though that would usually lean harder to PTB in a borderline issue) and breaking their own rules by doing so.

    I sympathize to some degree since a ban is a tad harsh for a first offense when the fediverse is harder to verify rules in than reddit was/is. But it’s on the user to do so, or accept the consequences when we don’t. I’ve had bans for just that reason; didn’t mean to cause a problem, but didn’t verify rules. You gotta suck it up and move on ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    • Taleya@aussie.zoneEnglish
      3·
      2 days ago

      I wouldn’t say a ban is a harsh result, they literally went into the comm with the intent to violate the rules, then sealioned. “Fuck off, troll” is usually what you write in the modlogs on that

  • Sanctus@anarchist.nexusEnglish
    7·
    3 days ago

    oh hey I just saw that. You went into an anarchist space because there was a mean meme about communism and decided to praise China.

    Also rule five:

    if you post angry replies you will get made fun of

    Womp womp

    • kibblebits@quokk.auEnglish
      4·
      3 days ago

      Well it’s not a mean meme about communism. It’s a meme about the fact that China isn’t communist.

    • subversive_dev@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
      14·
      3 days ago

      So far the threatened mockery has been underwhelming to be honest.

      Regarding the “anarchist space”:

      I don’t even bother engaging with the libs, for one thing they usually put “no tankies” in the sidebar so I block the community and move on. I have found the anarchists on lemmy to be much more open to honest discussion, BUT with some of the same Western brainworms about geopolitical adversaries.

      If you folks literally don’t ever want to have this discussion, you too can put “no tankies” in the sidebars and myself and others will not engage in your threads.

      Is that the Fediverse you want to inhabit? Seems boring to me

      • Luminous5481 "Enemy of the State"@anarchist.nexusEnglish
        5·
        3 days ago

        If you folks literally don’t ever want to have this discussion, you too can put “no tankies” in the sidebars and myself and others will not engage in your threads.

        memes only please, serious discussion is for other comms

        it’s literally a comm about pissing off people who aren’t anarchists, why did you think somebody who wasn’t an anarchist would enjoy the content?

        • subversive_dev@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
          04·
          3 days ago

          There are plenty of memes on ML’s meme comm that are flamebait, as we all know it generates lots of engagement

          I’m not arguing with your decision to post, I’m disagreeing with the content of the meme

          Why does that merit moderation action?

                • subversive_dev@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
                  03·
                  3 days ago

                  Well this comment thread is happening in YPTB, in either case why are you both dancing around the question of moderation instead of just saying what kind of speech you think should be allowed in your spaces?

  • thoro@lemmy.ml
    3·
    3 days ago

    I don’t disagree with your point or POV, but you went to an anarchist comm and confronted them over their distaste for China. They’re allowed to mod their comm against ML discourse. There are plenty of other spaces for MLs or left unity on these instances.

    It’s better to let them have their spaces then antagonize. Catch more flies with honey, etc etc

    • Grainne@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
      5·
      3 days ago

      Left Unity is always “do what we want or you’re a cia shitlib”. A huge red flag whenever a tankie talks about it.

      • thoro@lemmy.ml
        1·
        2 days ago

        Sure, but the alternative is often “condemn every implementation of socialism except the failed experiments in Ukraine and Catalonia or else you’re a red fascist”.

        Left unity is just supposed to be about focusing on building communism over sectarianism. Going into that space and immediately starting to go on a tirade about China or something is pretty much the same thing this post is about but from the other side.

        • Grainne@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
          2·
          2 days ago

          Not everyone on the left wants to build communism, I want to build anarchism. And I want to do that through not empowering authoritarian governments, even if they are a mythological dictatorship of the proletariat.

          We can agree on fighting capitalism and fascism, but when the disagreement is on authority things fall apart. Which is why I don’t call for left unity, I call for unity with anti-authoritarians.

          Left Unity is a saying for Marxists, because it never translates to what we’re fighting for.

    • subversive_dev@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
      12·
      3 days ago

      We don’t ban the libs just for being libs on ML, they have to pull out the racism card first.

      Like I said in another comment, if they don’t want any engagement from anyone who disagrees with them at a worldview level that’s disappointing but fine

      I happen to believe that they don’t want to be another DNC-pilled echo chamber but I’m certainly not going to post where I’m not wanted

    • subversive_dev@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
      12·
      3 days ago

      I think it’s best described as a philosophy that permeates their whole system of government.

      I think these examples are illustrative of the principle in action:

      • The Five-Year Plans aren’t just dreamed up by Xi Jinping, there’s a nationwide consultation process that starts from the bottom and builds up to a presentation for approval at the “Two Sessions”. That’s part of why they have so much internal legitimacy and why they tend to get accomplished
      • they have a number code (like 911 in the USA) except it’s for reporting minor city life issues like potholes and downed branches. Residents use it because they see the reported problems get fixed quickly
      • the cornerstone of the rural poverty alleviation program was making ground-level Party members individually responsible for specific families, meaning their career advancement opportunities were directly dependent on how well their families were doing getting out of poverty

      There’s so much more but those are the quick examples that came to mind

      • punkisundead [they/them]@slrpnk.netEnglish
        1·
        3 days ago

        Thank you for writing that out.

        Still sounds vague to me necause the actual process if decision making is not explained in a way that I can follow. Not just in your comment but also in the Wikipedia article.

        Like I understand the how the ideal process works in liberal democracy, how consensus decision making in small groups work or how a union in western europe makes decision. There are clear processes outlined and I am aware of atleast some of the informal things happening that could influence a decision.

        For me it would be helpful to have a transparent process explained that shows the for example how the nationwide consultation gets made and how its results get analyzed and put into the 5 years plan.

  • Commiunism@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    21·
    3 days ago

    it’s a shame anarchists continue their tradition in splitting the left and preventing anything from being done, instead of uniting with other leftists who want all the good and moral things (like this fine gentlexem OP here) and taking down John Capitalism who’s from USA (the only evil capitalist imperialist nation in the world)

    On an unrelated note, China please give us money

  • Luminous5481 "Enemy of the State"@anarchist.nexusEnglish
    21·
    3 days ago

    > AGITPROP< memes for anarchist dreams

    memes that glorify states will be removed

    if you post angry replies you will get made fun of

    what part of agitprop anarchist memes didn’t you understand? now you’re gonna end up on Tankiejerk too just for being whiny about it lol

    questioning the CIA narrative will get you banned

    ur a CIA narrative

  • therealdries@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    11·
    3 days ago

    hating the nations that should be your greatest allies in the fight.

    Yeah, I can just see these so-called “AES” falling over themselves to support socialist projects that can actually be called socialist with a straight face just like they’ve done… at absolutely no point in history whatsoever.