I have a coworker travelling there in July. Unwillingly, I’ve been more or less been kept in the loop what preparing the trip implies and I’m pretty horrified.
Up until now, these are some of demands made (and accepted):
- full disclosure and acess to social networks
- criminal record
- recent photo, perfectly groomed and in the attire to be used to travel there. No deviations will be tolerated from the supplied photo.
- complete list of possible identifying marks on the body, with pictures (tattoos, moles, melanistic spots, scars, etc)
- name and social networks of parents, siblings and other close relatives, including children.
The person is separated with two children; this is causing a lot of friction.
- has already been warned an interview of up to two hours will be held upon arrival.
The person speaks broken english at best.
- disclosure of place of employment and other connections to public organizations
They are connected to a local soccer club and a youth sports association.
To add to all of this, this isn’t a standard caucasian human but someone who has looks that can be taken for someone from the middle east, slightly darker shade of skin included.
Flying from southern europe straight to Florida.
I’m concerned. I would not go, full stop. They have people waiting there for them but nonetheless. Considering the heated state of affairs, it is something I consider of not easily to overlook risk.
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Don’t go. At all, for any reason. If what has already transpired during Trump’s second term hasn’t been enough reason to avoid travel, its on him if anything bad happens.
Can’t say you weren’t warned.
I’ve tried easing the notion to my coworker but the opportunity to travel abroad, even more because the tickets have been paid for by others, is too big to miss. Their words, not mine.
Why doesn’t he just fly to El Salvador directly and save time. I’m a Caucasian male and I wouldn’t go to the US right now, he definitely shouldn’t risk it.
I’d be problematic anyway because I genuinely don’t have a social media presence, which I’m sure they would find suspicious. And I’m pretty sure my 70-year-old parents don’t have one either.
I was just mentioning that as well. What could be the reception of someone with no social presence and no electronics upon arriving? I’d refuse giving details of relatives as well.
Your friend needs to ask the people who paid for the tickets if they’ll pay for legal representation and to get him released from whatever incarceration awaits him if he falls foul of the regime there. Assume this could run to hundreds of thousands of US dollars.
Also, given your description of him, I think that’s incredibly likely to happen.
They’ll say he’s guilty of something, so those friends won’t be sure whether he acted illegally or not.
I actively fear that.
Realistically, most people entering as tourists need to be concerned with CBP asking for unlocked access to your phone, which will disappear into a back room for a few minutes while they presumably steal all your credentials. The broader scare stories about detention, interrogation, and deportation are really very rare.
I have some (stupid) non-white-passing family that have been travelling to the US (including Florida) regularly and they have had zero issues.
I would absolutely not go. Full stop. But when you look at the real numbers, tourist entry into the US isn’t down all that much and most people who desire to go don’t have any issues with immigration.
You used to hear about needing a burner phone when visiting China, that it is now also required to visit the US is insane.
They probably won’t let you in if you bring a burner phone to USA
What is a burner phone? A phone with no direct association with your name? A prepaid plan?
I’ve mentioned this in the thread: what would be the reaction if someone arrived there with no electronics on them? And if further stated they did not intended to buy any for their stay? What could happen?
Anything could happen. To be totally honest, most Americans, myself included, have never been outside of the country, so we don’t know.
If I had to speculate based on the news, the fact that he isn’t white, doesn’t speak English well, and may have no electronics/ questionable electronics, all adds up to a high likelihood of him being detained for an indeterminate amount of time, and potentially being deported to somewhere that no one wants to be.
Honestly they would probably just back-track you because you’ll be more suspicious. Idk I’m just theory crafting but customs can look up employment and other data instantly, idk what else
You mean my civilian public identity data?
Let’s speak about me now: I have no social media presence and I like it like that. I pay my taxes, I drive a 20+ years car. I’m boring and I enjoy it as it is.
Someone telling me I seem suspicious because I have no electronics and no interest in using it would be gold.
Actual event: I was once stopped for speeding. The police pulling me up asked me if I hadn’t seen the FB post warning for the speed radar. And I bluntly put it that I had no account on the network. Their face was priceless. I got fined for speeding, fair, but that was that. Social networks are not official communication channels. They want to be, but they are not.
The phone part I wasn’t aware. There’s another reason to never keep sensible info in a phone and commit all accesses to memory.
Don’t take your phone with you. Put your sensitive information and credentials into Bitwarden. Buy a cheap smartphone from the U.S., install Bitwarden and use it. When leaving, log out of Bitwarden, delete the app, reset the phone and leave it behind.
I am not going anywhere.
But you made me wonder. What would be the reaction if someone went there and not carried a cellphone nor any other electronic equipment? And now I’m thinking about my own personal use of it. I can survive without internet for long bouts and my most important credentials are commited to memory, along with important numbers.
What could happen if someone just arrived at the gates with two book, a notebook and perhaps a couple of mechanical pencils and a pen?
My lawyers at my university say this behavior will get you detained. Really making it look like you have something to hide.
the phone part also means YOU are exposed and documented by the US fascists to the extent they have any messaging or email history with you on their phone. And everyone else they’ve messaged.
Even Americans, who aren’t Caucasian, are being put into ICE detention (or deported). The US is a dangerous place for anyone with darker skin. Even worse for visitors. Not even safe for Canadians.
They start with the dark skins and then they turn on the rest.
Considering how hard they are demonizing trans people, it’s only a matter of time before they go after the gays. I have a bug out bag ready to go if I need to hide in the wilderness.
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Heard the herd?
Forget it. Even before this shit happened, a middle eastern looking friend of mine had to stop going to US conferences because he would always get turned away at the border.
The person speaks broken english at best.
This makes everything that came before even more dangerous. One misunderstanding and they will put you in a holding cell for weeks.
years ago some researcher was on the news and often got extra harassed at their border for his middle eastern sounding name (but not actually related at all)
likely even worse now
This was very common back to the early 2000s.
I live in America but I’m fairly disconnected from everything that’s happening because I live in a very isolated area living a fairly isolated life. However from everything I’m hearing from the news, if I was in your position, I would not step foot here. The worst people imaginable are running the country and it’s genuinely not safe for even the people already living here.
I definitely would not give them any of the information you listed, that’s insane. These people cannot be trusted.
Unless it’s of vital life and death importance that you come here, it’s not worth the risk right now. Hopefully MAGA dies and sane people start running the country again, but right now I cannot in good consciousness recommend that you come here.
I am not going there. Full stop. But I work with this person on daily basis. I’m human. I get concerned.
Sorry I misread. I don’t want to alarm you but you have every reason to be concerned. He’s an adult, all you can really do is tell him the risks. Why does he feel the need to to come here right now? .
Visiting family of their current partner. And as the tickets were paid for by the family living there, there is an added feeling of obligation, but the main drive is the eagerness to travel abroad, the opportunity. Their words, not mine.
I’m sure you already have, but definitely discourage him heavily from doing that. A ticket can potentially be refunded. Even if it can’t, it’s replaceable. He on the other hand is irreplaceable. There’s only one if him and will only ever be one of him.
It’s definitely not worth going right now.
But he’s an adult, and is going to make his own choices. If he goes anyway, you did everything you could.
Most of those tourism stories are focused on towns along the Canadian border, most Canadians aren’t crossing the border unless they absolutely have to.
After reading all these comments, the impression I’m getting is: shithole country
At this current time, I wouldn’t recommend it. Generally speaking the people are welcoming and the things to see are plentiful.
But the issues visitors will run into aren’t with the people or landmarks. I don’t want to deal with law enforcement here and I’m a white male middle class citizen.
It is, don’t go there. I mean I love it here, but you wouldn’t.
Be aware of where these comments are coming from. There might be a slight bias here.
Yeah the exaggeration in here is wild
It’s a shithole country and it’s awful but coming here in a business trip is going to be without incident, it’s not fucking judge dredd
Yeah like what the fuck. Get a burner phone for travel? Extra clothes? Being followed?
You didn’t say why they’re coming. That matters. If they’re coming for soccer-related stuff, they may take a while to interview but they should pass through. In general, the US has millions of people traveling in and out of it per day. Most people don’t have any issue. It’s just that now, instead of only suspect people having issues, any random person can have an issue because of immigration enforcement quotas. The officers generally don’t care about you, the individual they arrest, at all. They arrest white American citizens without any legal authority. They’re just boosting their arrest quota. So, if something happens, it’ll be by random chance of the officer not caring about their job.
The person is travelling for leisure, visiting relatives of their current partner, that live there. I’ve been told they’ve been talking about going to watch a world cup match but the tickets are incredibly expensive and hard to get. That is the closest to the soccer connection it gets.
I have a white coworker who goes to the states almost every weekend to visit family… probably low risk since they’re white…
Here’s where is gets wild:
My manager is a muslim, clearly visibly middle eastern. Goes to NYC for meeting twice a month.
My friend is pakistani, muslim, middle name is mohammed right there in his passport. Goes to lots of midwest states for meetings at least once a month
Neither on has had any problems at the border and they tell me that my apprehensions about travel to the US are blown out of proportion…
I still wont go down there, but i hope for their sakes that they are right.
so basically 3/3 people i know who travel regularly to the states have no problems… clearly ymmv.
Low probability of incident, but very serious consequences if it happens
Low probability of incident, but very serious consequences if it happens
That sums it up. OP’s friend will probably be fine. It’s just, if not they’re not, it’s really gonna suck
Money.
It just depends on what border patrol agent you get on the day. I’m sure most of them are perfectly normal but at least some of them have been installed post Trump, and those guys see it is their sacred duty to see that no one gets in.
CBP were nazis well before Trump’s first term. They are all scum.
Show your friend this thread. This is a bad idea. There was an Irish woman held for months. No trip is worth what this could turn into.
Forgive me but I did an AI search and here is what it came up with.
🇩🇪 Germany Lucas Sielaff / Celov: A 25-year-old German citizen visiting his American fiancée was detained for 16 days at the Otay Mesa Detention Facility south of San Diego. He was taken into custody while returning from a day trip to Tijuana, Mexico, after border officials accused him of violating his 90-day tourist permit.
Jessica Brösche / Brocha: An artist from Berlin was detained for over six weeks, spending more than a week in solitary confinement. Authorities took her into custody at the San Diego border after accusing her of intending to perform unauthorized work because she was traveling with tattooing equipment.
Fabian Schmidt: A German national holding a U.S. green card was arrested and interrogated at the Boston airport upon returning from a vacation. His detention drew widespread criticism from local lawmakers.
🇬🇧 United Kingdom Becky Burke: A 28-year-old graphic artist from Wales was held in an ICE Processing Centre in Washington State for 19 days. The detention followed a visa mix-up when she was denied entry at the Canadian border while attempting to leave the U.S…
🇳🇴 Norway “Degman”: A Norwegian woman married to a U.S. citizen was arrested by ICE during a scheduled hearing at a U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services office in San Diego. She was held at Otay Mesa for a week for overstaying a visa before a judge terminated her case.
🇮🇪 Ireland Sheamus Culliton: An Irish citizen from Kilkenny who had lived in the U.S. for 17 years was detained in an ICE facility in Texas while awaiting his green card.
🇳🇱 Netherlands Owen Ramsingh: A permanent resident who immigrated to the U.S. from the Netherlands in 1986 had his green card revoked and was placed in ICE custody for removal proceedings following a trip to Europe.
🇫🇷 France Marie-Thérèse Ross: An 85-year-old French widow was arrested by ICE agents at her home in Alabama after overstaying her 90-day tourist visa. Ross had moved to the United States to marry a former U.S. serviceman she had first met in France in the 1950s. Following her husband’s death, she was placed in a Louisiana immigration facility where she was reportedly handcuffed by her hands and feet. She spent 16 days in federal custody before being deported back to France. Unnamed French Academic: A French researcher traveling to a conference in Houston, Texas, was denied entry and detained at the airport. U.S. border officials targeted the researcher after scanning their personal electronic devices and finding messages critical of U.S. academic research policies.
🇬🇧 United Kingdom Karen Newton: A 65-year-old retired British tourist was detained for six weeks (43 days) at the Northwest ICE Processing Center in Tacoma, Washington. Despite traveling with a valid tourist visa, she and her husband were swept up at the Sweetgrass border crossing in Montana while attempting to return to Canada. Because her detention coincided with a U.S. federal government shutdown, her release was significantly delayed.
🇧🇬 Bulgaria Dmitrii Georgiev: A Bulgarian citizen vacationing in Quebec, Canada, was detained by ICE for nearly three months. Georgiev inadvertently crossed the unmarked U.S.-Canada border line in a rural area, resulting in his immediate arrest and long-term placement in an immigration holding facility.
Your friend is playing with fire and could a get turned away at the airport or put in detention.
Miguel Barreno, a 40yo spanish migrant, spent 6 months in detention after voluntarily requesting going back to spain. Spent a month over a month in jail without being told why he was jailed. Source: https://elcomercio.pe/mag/respuestas/us/nos-trataron-como-al-peor-criminal-el-duro-relato-de-turistas-detenidos-por-ice-en-estados-unidos-nnda-nnse-noticia/
That is grim outlook!
I can’t vouch for the AI result above but I’m from NZ and we had a citizen mom detained with her kid for weeks, Sarah Shaw, who thankfully got out. However another of our citizens, Everlee Wihongi, has been detained for over a month now. ICEs strategy is to move people so they’re harder to find and they move them when they have a court appearance coming up so they have to “reschedule”.
You’re posting an LLM generated response as if you didn’t know it was generated by a random process. It might list the relevant facts, but it doesn’t distinguish between truth and falsehood, just that it sounds right.
I did hear about a white Irish person being detained for a long time wrongly by ICE, but this doesn’t sound quite the same.
Generally, please don’t post AI slop as if it were factual.
I added a link for each one.
Thanks.
I remember seeing a few spanish tourists being bothered too. I’ll see if I can concrete info to add
I wouldn’t do it lol. I’m from the USA and I don’t even wanna leave because I don’t wanna deal with our fucking customs guys.
Pre-COVID (Trump’s first time) I took a trip to Europe. All of the European customs officials were polite and professional, did what they needed to do, and still made me feel welcome in their country. When I returned to America, the customs official checking me back into the country was mean-mugging the entire time, rude, and acted like I wasn’t welcome back to my own home.
I had the same experience in Latin America and Asia. Although I did get stopped in Singapore for a kitchen knife I bought in Bali. They let me go and let me keep the knife!
don’t, just don’t.
if you have to, refuse.
stay out of the US right now. not because it’s particularly unsafe to be inside the country, but because it’s incredibly difficult to safely get inside.
not only that, but going to Florida is like starting foreplay with licking a dirty asshole. some might be into that, but everyone will end up with shit mouth by the end of the night.
I’m not going anywhere.
You made a pretty grim image. I’ll have nightmares, tonight.
Clearly I’m ignorant due to not traveling out of the country in decades, but those demands are shocking to me. We really have devolved into a fascist shithole, huh? They’ll probably be fine, but I certainly wouldn’t risk it.
That list is an automatic no from me. America is FAR down on the list of countries I would like to see one day, but as long as those requirements exist, absolutely not.
The US literally has nothing that would be worth this
No country is worth this. And even North Korea, someone shared here some time ago, is not that invasive. They do give you a nanny to escort you around, you can go everywhere, you can’t take pictures or film but they don’t care about what you do in your country.
You definitely can’t go everywhere in North Korea. The nanny escorts are to keep you on the guided tour trail. It’s why every documentary about going there consists of nearly identical content.
That was a typo on me. I have to rectify that.
If I was him, I would not go. Simple as that. The US is no safe place for travel.
At this point I wake up every day and wonder when being trans will be labeled a crime. They’ve come close to doing so, they’ve already set the precedent that they’re allowed to detransition you as punishment for a crime.
They’ve threatened to put AuDHD people on a list before too. The US is dangerously close to causing a second Holocaust with how they’ve acted thus far to any minorities.
How recent is that? Going after neurodivergents belongs to the middle ages.
RFK Jr was talking about “work camps” for anyone with an Adderall prescription just last year. Possibly more recently than that, it’s exhausting keeping up with all of the horrible things this regime says and does.
Ever since RFK Jr. took over the health department. The guy very publicly hates AuDHD people.
Inhumane
History repeat itself, in this case almost exactly 100 years later. This time on the other side of the ocean.
People should learn history.
